Weezerpedia Discord Q&A with Karl Koch - August 2023

From Weezerpedia

hailey :3: curious, what was the song "break up"/"break-up" recorded during the green album sessions? seen it mentioned on the green page and some karls corner pages but i dont think ive seen anything about it past the title

Karl: surprised theres not a demo of this in the green rc package? its a good song. recorded several times then never made it to green

August 18, 2023 2:33 PM (#karlification)

justinhoenke: Why is Pat not featured more prominently in interviews these days? For a while there he was doing a lot of reviews and boy howdy they were funny and I really liked his presence. Nowadays it seems like Brian and RC are at the focus of those interviews. I dig that too, but I do miss Pat.

lord bambiraptor: I feel like in 2020-2021 he did a surprising amount of interviews

Moony B'deedle: Yeah but he's done basically nothing during sznz vw etc

Karl: as a rule of thumb, Pats willingness to interview depends on his personal pleasure taken in the recording process of the album being covered. He loved working on OK Human and loves to talk about it. Sznz i know he felt not very connected to the final products, and ergo, wouldnt know how to comfortably talk about them.

August 18, 2023 2:38 PM (#karlification)

dylan (HMC): Karl, do you know if the song "I Want to Be Something" from Hurley Deluxe and Rivers' unheard demo of the same name from 1998 (C-11 in the Grand File) are the same song? One of Riv's demo bundles has this recording which is the same as the one on Hurley Deluxe except it has some heavier-sounding guitar layered over it. Seems plausible that it could have just been a song he resucitated a decade later, but that's just a guess on my part.

Karl: great question, can only confirm if i have access to said 1998 demo. i might/might not (1998-9 have strange gaps), but cant check as im back on the road now and the archive is back home. Maybe you guys can compile a list of these kinda 'recording' questions that ive not answered yet (theres got to be more way up the thread...), so i could tackle them all en masse at some point?

August 18, 2023 2:42 PM (#karlification)

dylan (HMC): Karl, is there any light you can shed on some of the cover songs documented in the Recording History around the Make Believe era (around 2004)? Some of them are known to be covers that Rick Rubin suggested (e.g. Unbreak My Heart), but others are just listed as "unknown cover" in the Recording History. There's a couple tracks listed as covers of unknown Trust Company songs, there's at least one listed as a cover of an unknown NIN song, and there's a song called "V. Carlton" listed as an unknown Vanessa Carlton song which seems like it might be (at least partially) a Rivers composition (Rivers released a demo of V. Carlton in one of his demo bundles but later removed it, which would track with it being a VC song, but the filename has a Catalog O' Riffs number and the chorus lyrics seem to imply that the song is called "How Was I to Know?", which is a title also listed in the Rec History around that same time). Were these all just songs that Rick suggested the band cover? Or were they, like, songs that other artists were shopping around?

Karl: ok, i dont recall Rick suggesting doing such covers, i think that was a thing that Rivers was just getting into at the time. As you guys know, he likes to do covers on stage, and of course one of their biggest singles ever was a cover. But way back in 2003-4, that notion was just getting going. If i noted them as "unknown" thats probably because i was at some point handed cd's, saw the cd tracklist and it said trust company or nin etc, and thats just what was written by someone (likely Sarah Kim at the time) who didnt know the titles and it was never tidied up (i.e. checked with Rivers... and then time marched on). As for the v. carlton thing - my guess is he wanted to write a song using that progression/etc and thus just copied it to start with, then kept messing with it.... but whether that ever led to a viable song is doubtful

August 18, 2023 2:50 PM (#karlification)

dylan (HMC): Why is the early mix of "Can't Stop Partying" dubbed the "Coconut Teaser Mix"? Is there a story or reason behind that?

Karl: haha - im sure theres no "story" per se, but of course the Coconut Teaszer was one of our early repeat lLA venues, so it was probably just a spur of the moment reference joke

August 18, 2023 2:58 PM (#karlification)

juan cena: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgJAQyy0BJs karl what is the song being performed around 23 seconds in, is that just improv or is it an actual song?

Karl: That's a slightly butchered cover of "Up The Beach" by Janes Addiction

August 18, 2023 3:02 PM (#karlification)

Burnst Jamp: Hey Karl, wondering if you can confirm some info about a few shirts:

  • Do you recall if the version of the "Rock Music" shirt (with the smaller emblem on the back) was ever printed by Winterland, or if it was always Giant? And, also, whether a red version of that one was made or only a dark blue and dark green?
  • Was the Giant-produced "If It's Too Loud" shirt first released in 1996, or 1998? The design is for sale in Weezine in issue 8 (Fall 96)--the same one where the previously-mentioned Rock Music design is mentioned--but it seems like that could maybe be Winterland backstock. It makes its "return" for sale in 1998 in Weezine issue 13 (iirc), after Giant is long-established as the band's merch distributor. The tag loosely suggests it was released pre-98 but not very strongly.
  • What versions of the babydoll sheep shirt were released, and which brand did each belong to? I have seen a classic T-shirt version of it, a blue ringer version, a green ringer version, and a black version with a white ringer; and I know Winterland, Cinder Block, and probably Giant released a version. I can only confirm that the green ringer and the black/white ringer ones were at one point sold by Winterland, and that a non-ringer version was sold by Giant. What other versions did they sell, if any, and what versions did Giant/Cinder Block sell?

Karl: ok so in general, we signed up with Winterland by mid September 1994, and started producing everything (retail, tour, fan club) from the start of the tour opening for Live which started 9/30/94. till at least fall 1996 or mid 1997 (cant recall offhand, but thats a very important distinction unfortunately). Giant was definitely the company from 1998-2001, but i forget if they had any of 1997. I also forget when we dumped Giant and went to Cinderblock. Probably 2002?? **Rock music shirts were the first Winterland shirts, in navy blue, dark green and maroon. they had "weezer" front, and "scrawled "ROCK =w= MUSIC" on the back (scanned form a napkin that Matt Sharp drew with Sharpie in a bar somewhere backstage somewhere). Giant reprinted later. **Winterland shirt #2 was the if its too loud shirt. white shirt, black ringer. All later editions incl Giant are re-dos. * * 3rd Winterland shirt was the "elvis/brush your teeth..." one* * Babydoll sheep were in our second wave of merch, more like 1996, but still started as Winterland. The first were white w/ ringer, then we added black w/ringer. Blue and Green ringers are later but i think considerably later so id guess Giant for those. And Giant redid the original sheep designs at least once. The weird one you linked to (baby blue top thing) i cant say i know whats up with that, so id guess its much later, and who knows but likely CInderblock.

August 18, 2023 3:33 PM (#karlification)

Burnst Jamp: Giant did everything (it seems) for the Pinkerton tour (Cornucopia, Timmy/Punk Rock girl, etc.), so they were definitely in the door by 1997 at the earliest. In Fall 1996 you guys released a version of Winterland's "Rock Music" tee but with a much smaller emblem on the back. I own one of these and have seen a few online--all of which have had Giant tags. It could very well have originated as a Winterland and later migrated to Giant though, which muddies the waters.
I have a very early/incomplete prototype of an archive of the Giant releases that has some of my research on the earliest Giant pieces here, if there's any useful insight: https://www.weezerpedia.com/wiki/Catalog:Giant_Merchandising_(merchandise)

Karl: aha! well the tags tell the story then, Giant came in sooner than i remembered. But: timmy/punk girl i am pretty sure came out in 2001. do we have physical proof otherwise? pinkerton era shirts i am sure of: sheep, cornucopia, starboy, umbrella (and actual album cover of course)... also re: that Giant page: the original winterland if its too loud shirts were white with black ringers, not all white. (that ringer design was reissued much later). And there was a blue longsleeve version too. it was super rad, looked like a Spock uniform shirt from star trek.

Karl: oh also winterland did the first blue album cover shirts. they were white with the blue square cover design, later they did an all blue one. there was a longsleeve one with the white shirt/cover square too.

August 18, 2023 10:30 PM (#karlification)

Burnst Jamp: Im almost certain Timmy/Punk Girl were sold during the No Doubt wing of the Pinkerton tour! That's the story told most places online, anyway. They were ALSO sold in 2001, reprinted by Cinder Block (at least, Punk Girl was. Timmy wasnt IIRC)

Burnst Jamp: The umbrella design isn't ringing a bell, which one is that?
Ooh and dont forget Pinkerton Cats

Karl: fair enough, i am only remembering the Giant re-do i guess.
oh - right! pinkerton cats. that and starboy were by og WFC member Elena Jensen, she was part of the original first wave of LA area fans

August 18, 2023 10:33 PM (#karlification)

Karl: fall 1992 shirt. either 20 or 40 made

Karl: 1994 (summer, pre winterland) the front had correct font weezer with the hand scrawled w

Karl: there was a white one too i forgot (1994 fall - winterland)

Karl: and this "3/4 sleeve" too (1994)

Karl: 1995

Karl: 1995 v2

Karl: v2 back

Karl: 1995

Karl: 1995 (rear)

Karl: 1995 (earlier than i remembered)

Karl: 1995

Karl: 1995 back (forgot about this one too)

Karl: 1995 "Spock" (dont have a rear photo, forget if there was a back design) **these are exceedingly rare

Karl: 1995

Karl: 1995 back

Karl: 1995 absurd bootleg front

Karl: 1995 absurd bootleg back

Karl: sadly i dont have a set of 1996-7 photos in my local (this laptop) stuff. i do have some other merch photos you should have. ill add them here asap

August 18, 2023 10:43 PM (#karlification)

Karl: the umbrella shirt must be rare AF now - i cant find it on the googles. it was a medium blue/gray with a hand drawn red umbrella, shielding the word "weezer" from the rain

August 18, 2023 10:59 PM (#karlification)

Karl: sept 2001 Midget Tour merch

Karl: 1994 Xmas show

Karl: 2001 Inland Invasion shirt

Karl: Pat Finn with one of the 3 known surviving 1992 t-shirts. I have one and Matt Sharp has his (now-deceased) father's.

Karl: July 2002+ tour merch (the next bunch are all this set)

August 19, 2023 4:31 PM (#karlification)

dilavni.band(.com): weezer panties?

Burnst Jamp: There were at least 3 different pairs of these sold iirc

Karl: this was via a GF of Brian's who thought that was a great idea and... so... it happened. They did sell though lol

August 19, 2023 4:41 PM (#karlification)

deckra: had no idea those weezer logo oval stickers were sold- totally thought they were fanclub exclusive

Karl: they arent the same exact sticker, i believe

August 19, 2023 5:05 PM (#karlification)

Karl: 2005 bootlegs


August 19, 2023 4:42 PM (#karlification)

Karl: front of a summer '94 Bokkus shirt

Karl: idk who brohiem is, i just dont have a photo of the front rn lol

August 19, 2023 4:53 PM (#karlification)

Karl: this is for reference - this is the fake, bootleg (laughable art) Goat Punishment shirt. We did a run of 300 (real ones) in 2000, sold them at the summer GP shows in LA., and then these goofy ones popped up months later. i feel like they made their screen from a bad jpg of the real one, and cleaned it up all silly because they couldnt see the details

Karl: the boot also has the =gp= on the back (looks pretty close to original)

August 19, 2023 4:57 PM (#karlification)

Karl: just a decent example of the summer 1994 shirt, and with copyright detail

August 19, 2023 4:58 PM (#karlification)

Karl: this is another Midget tour (fall 2001) shot - not sure if its redundant or has things the other photo doesnt have. it has the tenacious d and jimmy eat world stuff though

August 19, 2023 5:04 PM (#karlification)

deckra: karl i wanted to share this stupid rare promo cd i got recently. my question is: can i stop collecting weezer now? i feel like i can't top this

Karl: idk ive had it since 1996 and im still collecting weezer so....

deckra: shit... you're right
guess i cant throw in the towel just yet

Karl: but - congrats - that is i think the first time ive seen someone else find one of those. at least since before modern internet times anyway. its a lot easier to find some of the other "rare" weezer items

August 19, 2023 4:21 PM (#karlification)

Karl: totally forget if i took this picture or what

August 19, 2023 5:01 PM (#karlification)

dilavni.band(.com): why do you have coca cola monopoly

Karl: that was in this crazy warehouse, i must have taken the shot now that i think of it. I was helping a friend sort out a 18 wheeler trailer full of records he bought for his collectibles store, and the warehouse he was using was a huge mess of books, games and basically what youd imagine a barnes and noble would look like if you picked it up and shook it upside down and abandoned it.
but did i end up with the raditude display? i dont think so and i dont know why

August 19, 2023 5:08 PM (#karlification)

deckra: have you ended up with any store displays in your collection over the years?

Karl: i do have the pinkerton mobile - unpunched and still folded
this isnt mine

August 19, 2023 5:10 PM (#karlification)

deckra: sometimes i wonder where this display ended up

Karl: wish i knew

August 24, 2023 2:49 PM (#karlification)

dilavni.band(.com): oh yeah, someone visited the universal archives recently and uploaded the video to youtube, they caught this master tape from the green sessions which is pretty cool

Karl: Are those archives not in LA? because as we know Universal had that fire in their old warehouse that they were too slowly organizing/moving. We were told nothing weez was there, and i know where much of the stuff is now, far from LA.

August 24, 2023 2:51 PM (#karlification)

eted: did pat ever properly record any tsg material with mikey? i know that you all toured together fall 99 & spring 00, but was just wondering if mikey was on any unreleased tsg demos or studio tracks

Karl: pretty sure its mikey on some of the unrelesed demos circa 99-00. not sure whats in =wp= about that murky time

August 24, 2023 2:54 PM (#karlification)

juan cena: Hey Karl, on the weezer.net site there used to be a page dedicated to setlists for the Yahoo Outloud and 2001 Japan tours, most of these have been archived except for an image of the setlists for the first Tokyo show and the Sendai show. Would you happen to still have the image? (file name is Japan1and2Setlists.jpg btw)

Karl: happy to supply - there's a major list somewhere of missing photos that im supposed to dig up. are these images on that list? its a page somewhere. ive been delinquent

August 24, 2023 2:56 PM (#karlification)

hailey :3: curious, how would blast off, superfriend and dont worry baby have been released on golden nuggets? were they all the rivers demos as released later on the alone series?

Karl: Blast off had the 1995 early version from August sessions at Electric Lady, but ive been unable to get that released because Rivers and Pat both dislike the drumming on it. (i didnt know how much pushback there would be at that time). the other 2 would have been pulled from RC demos. But in 2000 I think i was still hoping there would be a superfriend on the masters from pinkerton. but later when doing deluxe, while there were some surprises (like an acapella "dude were finally landing" with RC and Matt) there was no SF - must have been wiped.

August 24, 2023 3:00 PM (#karlification)